Home > Exodus, Focus on the Family/FRC > Exodus VP Randy Thomas Interviewed As Transgender Authority

Exodus VP Randy Thomas Interviewed As Transgender Authority

March 28th, 2008

From the American Psychological Association (APA) on the differences between sex and gender:

Sex refers to biological status as male or female. It includes physical attributes such as sex chromosomes, gonads, sex hormones, internal reproductive structures, and external genitalia.

Gender is a term that is often used to refer to ways that people act, interact, or feel about themselves, which are associated with boys/men and girls/women.

Randy Thomas, who apparently does not understand the differences between sexual identity and gender identity, mentioned in a recent interview with CitizenLink:

These activists are preaching this very strict worldview that there is no gender, and people are left confused. It’s no wonder that they come up with all kinds of ways to identify. [emphasis added]

The gender identifier of a transgender is still very much male or female. Transgenders are in no way confused about their sexual or gender identity. In the beginning of the article, the associate editor of CitizenLink, Devon Williams, cited the APA with a misleading definition of transgender:

According to the American Psychological Association, “transgender” is a term used to describe people whose self-perception differs from their biological gender. This condition is commonly referred to as gender identity disorder.

However, in their FAQ about transgenders, the APA clears up the misconception. CitizenLink failed to cite the views of other medical and health professionals. Although they quoted the APA, CitizenLink totally misinterpreted their research which uses “transgender” as the “umbrella term” for different kinds of variant gender groups. Gender Identity Disorder (GID) is already known scientifically as a unique subset.

Thomas went on to elaborate about his past article “The Transgender Double Standard“:

The activist community tells me, as a “post-gay,” that I have to embrace my genetic destiny, even though it hasn’t been proven that homosexuality is genetic. Whereas, when it comes to the transgendered, they’re allowed to ignore their genetic destiny and perceive for themselves who they are. So there’s a double standard there.

His belief that transgenders are ignoring their “genetic destiny” is completely inaccurate. He takes for granted the biological, chromosomnal and psychological state of transgenders, as the whole article failed to address sexual ambiguities that may face children even before puberty. The genetic destiny of transgenders actually lies in these various factors, something which Thomas did not seem to be well informed of.

Thomas continued:

I don’t think that the nation is ready for the all-inclusive transgendered agenda that the transgendered activists have laid out. Last year, there was a huge split in the gay community regarding whether transgendered should be included in their legislative goals. So if the gay community is not ready for transgendered so-called “rights,” I doubt that the public at large is going to tolerate that.

The case mentioned here is the Employment Non-Discrimination Act. But the removal of gender identity by the Human Rights Campaign (HRC) upon submission of the Act was a political move rather than an attempt to deny transgender rights, and hundreds of gay and lesbian groups were angered by that decision. Has Thomas also overlooked the fact that the Matthew Sheppard Act was submitted inclusive of gender identity? To infer from this that the gay and lesbian community is intolerant towards transgenders is pretty far fetched.

To Thomas, gender identity is important to God. But knowing what gender identity is seems to be of little importance to Thomas. He would do well to study and research more about the complex issues regarding transgenders instead of accusing “transgendered activists” of creating confusion and chaos, while he appears to know almost nothing on the issue. As the vice president of Exodus International, he should educate himself diligently to avoid the embarrassment of talking without facts and speaking without truth.

We would like to note that we went through the proper channels at Exodus to inquire about Thomas’ credentials in dealing with this complex issue, and finally received the following (emails to Thomas went unanswered):

Ms. Choe,

Below is a response to a email that was sent to Julie Neils about Randy
Thomas. I am responding on behalf of Mr. Thomas.

“It is my personal policy to refrain from responding to inquiries from activist organizations and affiliated web sites that have distributed erroneous information and demonstrated intolerance toward my faith and viewpoints. My personal opinions and beliefs surrounding the work of Exodus International are public record both on our corporate web site www.exodus.to and on my personal blog www.randythomas.org.”;

Thank you,

Melissa Condrey

Executive Assistant to Alan Chambers,
President, Exodus International and
Randy Thomas, EVP, Exodus International
mcondrey@exodus.to
407.599.6872

Neither reference provides the credentials requested in our inquiry, and the second reference, Thomas’ personal blog, has been deleted from the web on a regular basis, thereby sanitizing enormous amounts of information which may have helped us understand better if he is qualified to make such statements as those in the original CitizenLink article.

We regret that Exodus, a ministry, is not more transparent with information as basic as this, and we are disturbed that they try to justify this with libelous statements about XGW. In the end, however, we believe CitizenLink should have provided this information with the original article before allowing Thomas to comment authoritatively on the issue.

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  1. March 28th, 2008 at 17:34 | #1

    “Genetic Destiny?” Why is it the only people who are obsessing over the “gay gene” are anti-gay people? Last I heard, nobody on our side actually believes that homosexuality is solely caused by a single gene or genetic factor. Yet they keep throwing it “back” at us to show we’re “wrong about the gay gene” and about homosexuality and biology altogether, because THEY think that’s what WE think.

  2. March 28th, 2008 at 21:52 | #2

    Unfortunately, this article is no different from any Christian work on trans people. The only variation is how they misrepresent tran individuals, the trans community, the APA, and the Bible.

    Truth is, there is no Christian authority on trans people or issues that evangelicals will accept. The only people with any education or clout with trans issues don’t support the evangelical/fundamentalist agenda.

    One time in a group conversation with other trans people, I mis-spoke and said, “I don’t believe in gender.” Everyone laughed immediately because they recognized I made a mistake. Randy Thomas needs to actually talk to some trans people so he can realize how out of touch he is with what we say.

    Thanks, Yuki, for your work.

  3. March 29th, 2008 at 15:02 | #3

    I cringe every time I encounter one of these nitwits making pronouncements about my experiences. Randy Thomas is no more qualified to speak on transgender issues than he to expound upon any other issue that he has no real experience or background in.

    However, a lack of background hasn’t stopped NARTH’s Dr. Breiner from spouting off about us, either.

    Randy Thomas is at least quasi-honest about it – he’s a pseudo-christian bigot who is obviously speaking from ignorance; NARTH keeps trying to portray themselves as having actual background.

  4. March 29th, 2008 at 21:37 | #4

    Just wish to bring to your attention these slides from the Exodus Asia Conference back in 2003 at Hong Kong and Taipei:

    (If you are a transgender, or especially if you are a transsexual, brace yourself)

    EAC 2003 (HK) Power Point files.

    EAC 2003 (TP) Power Point files.

    On both, “Gender Identity Disorder” basically means “disturbance in sexual desire that causes a person distress and interpersonal difficulties”

    Both slides are of course similar… except that the slide for EAC Hong Kong includes all these under the “Gender Identity Disorder Types”….

    Homosexuality
    Paraphilia
    Exhibitionism
    Fetishism
    Frotteurism
    Pedophilia
    Sexual-Masochism
    Sexual Sadism
    Transvestic Fetishism
    Voyeurism

    Some truths regards to the DSM-IV were presented… until the halfway point when Dr. Melvin Wong decided to enter his own say into the issue, then Focus On The Family’s sub-standard science enters the tray….

    They called Gender Identity Disorder, long proven as an innate condition, as an identity issue that comes from… you know… Incomplete or insecure gender identity, family brokeness that includes mentally unsound parents or alchoholics, relationships with friends, bad environmental influences, bla bla bla….

    A good look at these slides show just how many decades behind Exodus and Focus On The Family’s “science” is.

    The end of the slide for Taipei’s is perhaps the most revolting to me-

    Under Treatment… Remember: Most are victims of sexual abuse….

    I shall remain calm in the heart at the accusations of being a victim of sexual abuse and having mentally disordered parents by Dr Melvin and FOTF… *screaming* ….

  5. March 29th, 2008 at 22:37 | #5

    This was an Exodus presentation???

  6. March 29th, 2008 at 23:02 | #6

    Apparently so:

    From Exodus Global Alliance:

    2003 Exodus International directs resources under the leadership of Melvin Wong to develop new ministries in the Far East. An ex-gay ministry in Taiwan joins Exodus Asia Pacific. A second conference is held in Hong Kong. New ministries are started in Hong Kong, Malaysia and Indonesia. Developments also occur in India and Sri Lanka under the leadership of Peter Lane

    Looks like we are all really gender confused… to them….

  7. March 29th, 2008 at 23:35 | #7

    Now on the homosexual front, it still resounds the same.

    And I presume this is for the Focus On The Family conference at Singapore late 2003.

    Melvin Wong speaks again.

    Homosexuality: Myths And Truths

    Root Causes of Homosexuality… The Hidden Secret of Psychiatry & Psychology in understanding the formation of Homosexuality…
    It is about Gender Identity Disorder

    I found another similar, but less dramatic version here:

    Both Robert Brennan and Melvin Wong are working for the Apokata Psychological Services, and it is an Exodus Member Ministry. Melvin Wong as far as I know was not eligible to join the American Psychological Services.

  8. March 29th, 2008 at 23:52 | #8

    The auto links do not work again. So here are the presentations.

    Homosexuality: Myths And Truths -
    http://www.christianmentalhealth.com/doc/pps/mythsandtruths4.pps

    The less dramatic version -
    http://www.apokata.addr.com/Powerpoint/Myth%20or%20Truth%20about%20homosexuality.ppt

  9. March 30th, 2008 at 05:03 | #9

    Asking Randy to comment on the trasgendered is like asking him to comment on how to make french fries, who cares.

  10. Emproph
    March 30th, 2008 at 08:13 | #10

    From his blog: ABC’s 20/20 to Focus on ‘Gay Gene’ Debate Tonight

    Update after the segment: So the only hat tip to ex-gays is to not even interview one? The only position put forward is from a young gay identified man who says all we do in those “groups” is teach “denial”?

    I wish that the media would accept the fact that not everyone with same sex attraction has to embrace a gay identity or worldview. They need to present the whole context of what it means instead of the simplistic stereotypes and dismissive attitudes toward “ex-gays.”

    Nope. No denial there.

    Now, from his “The Transgender Double Standard

    Therefore, since most “transfolk” as others have called them, tow the gay fundamentalist line… they are celebrated as “the new gay.”

    However, for those of us who want to pursue loving, whole, satisfying, passionate, congruent with our faith, opposite sex relationships instead of pursuing same sex sexual activity … somehow we are the ones deserving of mockery and condescending judgment.

    And before we continue, let me be the first to say that the following content in regard to Randy Thomas, has nothing at all to do with the following mockery and condescending judgment of Randy Thomas — as a godless heathen I just thought I’d mesh the two for the mere fun of it.

    Some of the “loving, whole, satisfying, passionate, congruent with our faith, opposite sex relationships” that we militant homosexual activists seem to have a problem with:

    Hate Crimes Ad Campaign Launches Across the United States
    My last two trips to DC were lobbying on Capital Hill, meeting with conservative groups and moderate groups about this type of legislation. I will continue to lend my voice and talents

    And:
    Video: Exodus V.P. Defends Right to Do What’s Wrong: Discriminate

    And this, and this, and this, and this, and this, and this, and this

    And lest we forget how inconvenient violence against gays is for you:

    It’s opportunistic of these activists to try and turn this horrible tragedy into an opportunity to smear those who oppose public sex and the same sex redefinition of marriage.

    Yes indeed Randy, it’s all about the gays trying to prevent you from simply living your life in ex-gay peace. In fact I’m sure Lawrence King and Simmie Williams, Jr. would have made it a point not to have gotten murdered had they known how offensive it would have been to you.

  11. Emproph
    March 30th, 2008 at 10:02 | #11

    Hi, um…could somebody check the spam filter please?

    And, if possible, credit me for ten minutes of edit time..

    …you know what, five, I’ll take five. I feel pretty confident with it.

  12. March 30th, 2008 at 10:34 | #12

    Found it. I’m sure it was all the links. Not sure what you mean about crediting edit time?

  13. Emproph
    March 30th, 2008 at 11:19 | #13

    Thank You! (and Just joking about the credit btw ;)

  14. Regan DuCasse
    April 2nd, 2008 at 20:08 | #14

    Excellent work, Yuki…

    There is more than a whiff of condescension and disdain that, given ANY other medical or even mental condition of a person wouldn’t be met that way with compassionate professionals.
    Gender and gender identity have nothing to do with one’s competence for a profession or intellect. And gender isn’t a matter of moral values and standards.

    So, it would seem that most of this opposition is religious based, and it is strange that the ex gay movement WOULD turn to a stranger bedfellow to make THEIR case (Freud).

    What Thomas needs to explain is why gender is a moral issue with him…let alone a political one.

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